Wow! Did I get it for my post Christians Declaring Bankruptcy. I couldn't even publish all the comments because I got tired of being accused of being judgmental and making cruel statements. The one thing I didn't hear in any of these comments of those who had to file for bankruptcy is their desire to ever pay it back. I didn't hear about their faith and trust in a God who owns the cattle on a thousand hills to help them make good on what they owe. Is anything too hard for the Lord? {Genesis 18:14}
When we declare bankruptcy and do not consider paying it back, we do to others what we would not want done to ourselves. We do harm to our neighbor. Love your neighbor as yourself. Love does no harm to its neighbor. {Romans 13:9,10} Someone has to pay your debt. If you are able to work in any way, you need to commit to paying back your debt. Owe no man anything, but to love one another. {Romans 13:8}
Being called judgmental when all I do is teach God's Word as I see is wrong. We are called to rebuke, admonish, and encourage each other. We are not to judge each other in what they eat or the days they celebrate or those outside the church body, according to Scripture, but we are absolutely called to admonish those who call themselves Christians.
Our nation is deep in debt and ready to declare bankruptcy. We are called to be light in this dark world and not live the way the world lives. What an example to the world Christians would be if they were to start paying back their debt. Give everyone what you owe him...if revenue, then revenue. {Romans 13:7}
Laine has a great article about 50 Ways We Paid Off Our House. If you are in debt or have declared bankruptcy and would like to pay it back, I suggest you read it and apply it. She has some great ideas! Dave Ramsey is another man who comes highly recommended by many who have been able to get out of debt and stay there!
Some say conservatives are cold-hearted and don't care about the poor. Those who are truly poor, disabled, and cannot work, we completely agree in helping and getting government assistance. If the government only helped those truly in need, we would not be in the financial mess we are in now. However, our government helps way too many people that can work, therefore, has put us on a treacherous path to destruction.
And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2
Logging you in...
Nicole · 643 weeks ago
In August, we made the decision to move back to my little itty bitty hometown and purchase a $30,000 foreclosed home. My parents graciously paid for the home so that the kids and I could get moved quickly and we would have time to sell our house. My husband has been in our $400,000 house since then trying to sell it. As you can imagine, we cannot sell it for what we owe. And the value of our home has decreased dramatically over the past few years. But, with all of our other debt (totally our own fault), we can't take less than what we owe against it.
After much prayer, we have made a deal with the mortgage company to do a Deed in Lieu of Foreclosure, which basically means we deed our house to them and they forgive our debt. Then they can sell it to recoup the cost of our loan. It is possible that the second mortgager will end up with nothing.
BUT we have every intention of paying them whatever they don't get paid out of the sale of the home. My husband will still be keeping his current well-paying job in our previous state (four hours away from us) and living in a cheap apartment during the week in order to get all of our debt paid. Until that is done, we will only see him on the weekends. That will likely take a couple of years. During this time we will also be paying off my parents for this house so that we can own it free and clear within the next couple of years (hopefully). We do not have car loans, so we will take care of our cars so that they can get us by until we can afford to pay cash for new ones.
Never will we make these decisions again. Never again will we live beyond our means. It is miserable and we are now in bondage. Our family cannot even be together. I homeschool our children, and we feel that it's important that I continue to do that, so I do not work outside the home. I do have a prospect for employment from home starting next September teaching a business law class online, as I am a former attorney and am currently writing the curriculum for that class.
I write all this to say that although we are taking an "easy way out" with our home, we do feel that it is our responsibility to pay our creditors what we owe them and intend to do so. We know that we have consequences to pay for our poor decisions, and that in the meantime God will continue to provide for us.
We are THANKFUL for these hard lessons that have taught us that LESS IS CERTAINLY MORE. Strengthening our family and doing our best to protect ourselves from a socialist government is our goal. Hopefully someday soon we will be doing that debt free.
I just wanted to thank you for being so bold as to speak out with God's truth. I don't always like what you have to say, but know that you are speaking the truth in Love. And oftentimes I am convicted to make changes in my life.
Blessings,
Nicole
Cassie · 643 weeks ago
Cassie · 643 weeks ago
Katherine · 643 weeks ago
Kathy
Tiffany · 643 weeks ago
Maybe that is a little off topic from your post, sorry...but my point is that the viewpoint of so many people now is that there's always the government to fall back on, rather than fighting to the death to support ourselves. I think our society has major "want" issues. Couples are getting into "starter homes" within a few years of marriage that are nicer and larger than any dream home our grandparents could have imagined. We think we need brand new furniture to fill those homes (which is paid for by credit!) It seems that people are always looking for bigger and better. I think if we all stepped back and took on the mindset of our grandparents when it comes to working hard, saving money, and living modestly, homes and families and in turn our country would be much stronger!
Debbie · 643 weeks ago
Carrie B · 643 weeks ago
We started employing Dave Ramsey's principals prior to marriage and paid for the wedding and honeymoon in cash. Using Dave's plan doesn't matter, but having ANY plan is what's important. We had very poor financial role models growing up (his parents charged everything and mine filed bankruptcy twice, each time racking up new debt) and we started doing those same habits, racking up our own college and credit debt.
We haven't been perfect, but we're managing to pull ourselves out bit by bit by bit. Sometimes we take steps backwards, sometimes we make huge strides forward. I can't wait to be debt-free! I will do a happy dance you can't even believe on that day, even if it's 20 years from now. This is me paying for the choices I've made and said, "Eh, I'll deal with it later." I feel no judgement for trying to do the right thing. Maybe the folks who felt judged feel so because they know, somewhere inside, that they made bad decisions and can't come to terms with that. I own my bad choices and I'm choosing to move forward and dig myself out!
Kessa · 643 weeks ago
Liz · 643 weeks ago
But I'm glad you didn't back down from your position, even if it did offend some people.
It's natural to be defensive when truth hits close to home, but it's necessary in order for change to happen.
I mean no offense to people who have filed bankruptcy or have messed up financially.
I made a *HUGE mess* of my financial life as a young adult and am still paying for it 10 years later.
And 3 years ago I would have been the most defensive person out there!
By the grace of God I had people willing to speak truth into my life, even at the expense of the relationship we have.
So many of my friends have an "instant gratification" mindset and aren't willing to consider that their short-term decisions with money have such a long-term consequence.
But I don't think life is without fun either. But the definition of "fun" has to meet your current reality. And personally, I look forward to the day that my debt is gone totally (only 3 more years! YAY!) and I can change my definition of "fun" to mean taking that vacation I've been saving for instead of going out to eat once a week with a coupon.
Yes, I'm weird like that. :-)
Lizzy · 643 weeks ago
Cindy B · 643 weeks ago
So much so I reposted it on our private christian wives group to help them think about ideas to keep us from getting to that point......Thank you!
Ken · 643 weeks ago
Forgiveness is freeing for both the the one who needs the forgiveness and the one who gives it. Holding onto bitterness destroys a person. Hey, it all gets adjusted in the next world anyway... or it never needs adjusting as Christ is far more sufficient than money or wealth.
I am sorry to hear about the burdens placed on your family by others :{ but so happy to hear that they handle it with grace and forgiveness.
Angela · 643 weeks ago
I think that churches and the community needs to step in and offer financial counselling and advice to educate people and hopefully prevent the need for bankruptcy to be declared in the first place. I also think we need to work to promote a simpler way of life without the crazy consumerism I'm a big fan of Dave Ramsay and his programs to provide financial education.
Nancy S · 643 weeks ago
@sheilagregoire · 643 weeks ago
Do people like it? Nope. But you're still right, because what you say is straight from the Bible. People seem to forget that Paul said, "whoever does not work should not eat." We are meant to look after ourselves when we are capable of working. And then we are also to look after those in our community who are not capable of working. But there is a difference between the deserving poor and the undeserving poor, and people seem to forget that even the Bible made that distinction.
Tina N · 643 weeks ago
Thank you for posting these truths. I read some of the bankruptcy comments and was rather surprised, myself, at the number of people who disliked or took offense to the post. I wanted to say thank you for telling it like it is, straight up, no sugar coating.....oh that is such a breath of fresh air. As a matter of fact, I love all the posts that I have read to date. Please keep testifying to God's truths, we (Christian wives and mothers) need to hear these things.
I am very thankful I found your blog.
Because He Lives,
Tina
Sally Vreeland · 643 weeks ago
kimhall724 30p · 642 weeks ago
Although we were never deeply in debt, we were very poor stewards of our money. We discovered Dave Ramsey's Financial Peace University a few years ago and found HOPE. We got debt free and became facilitators and have seen two things over and over again: Folks don't know how close they are to the edge until that one big event shoves them hard over the cliff (that was us), and folks can get pretty defensive about their situation being "fine" because they can't see how close they are to the edge.
Like so many other folks, there was so much we didn't understand about simple budgeting and planning. If we had been better money managers, we would have been much more able to handle the storms that came our way.
A friend of mine has just released her book on coming out of debt, and how others can do it too: Living Beyond Rich. She and her family paid off $150,000 of consumer debt. Their trigger was their 7 year old being diagnosed with Type 1 Diabetes, and the over $4,000 deductible plus other medical related bills they immediately faced. Her story is too typical, and their road out of debt a struggle, but her message is so full of hope! Here's the Amazon link: http://ow.ly/fLGUO
2happy4 66p · 642 weeks ago
Brenda · 639 weeks ago
Ken · 639 weeks ago
The year of Jubilee is actually every 50 years, (after 7 x 7 years). The scriptures are quite clear on the fact that all who borrow should pay back their debt. This is God's ideal and one that should be taught to believers. One should not be borrowing what they cannot repay, and the point of most of Lori's posts is to teach God's ideals. It would be a long post if every exception is considered.
I found an interesting article on the subject on debt and lending you may wish to review, especially the conclusions, by a Senior Research Fellow at Oxford and looking at all the possible passages on lending. It also deals with lending to micro-economies which I know you are a part in structuring around the globe: http://www.ocms.ac.uk/transformation/articles/180...
There is not much in the scriptures about lending, but the expectation is that if one lends they are to be repaid. Even if the Ox or goat dies when it is being lent, the borrower is to repay loss. But what if the Ox was old :)? God does not frown on commerce, and it is right to assume that some will have resources they have worked hard to obtain and will lend to those who need temporary help, or to finance a business venture.
It may be a healthy thing to have a year of Jubilee every 50 years, as it would certainly cut down dramatically on the excesses of lending that is seen, especially in the US. I cannot get rid of some of my credit cards. I call the bank to stop the credit and they do everything they can to keep me on their books, even as I never use the card. The banking laws and rules in the US make easy and ready credit available to anyone who is proven half worthy, and there is no doubt that the bank gets burned from time to time, all the while jacking up interest rates to have others pay for the loss. It's a terribly destructive system. Good credit and lending built and sustains our country and excesses in lending and borrowing will destroy things, or maybe reset things for a Year of Jubilee. If Congress and the President do not act soon to kick the can and debt down the road, we may have the Year of Jubilee forced upon us, and millions of hard working people will what their lives go to financial ruin.
The Bible says that if one borrows they should do all they can to repay their debt. It is not fair to the one who lent, unless perhaps they lent unfairly, which is exceptional, not to be repaid. Commerce only exists if people keep their word and it would be a disaster to have everyone, especially believers all walking around claiming that someone forced them to take the money.
Although God's covenant grace is a great model for how we should be with others, I am sure we can agree that the model should not be applied as a blanket rule to commerce or even lending. If that were the case, I am sure that God would have instructed not just the debt of the poor to be forgiven, but all debts to be forgiven.. and then you would have no lending at all. Borrowing and lending is a good thing, and you are not wrong to note exceptions, but the post deals in God's ideals.
If you borrow money, repay it. If you cannot repay, ask for leniency from your creditor. But do not excuse your debt which you freely entered into, because God's grace is vast and complete when it comes to salvation. To use this broad a stroke would have us all fall into antinomianism where grace covers all and all debts, so why live with integrity and keep my word? How can I ask for my money back when God has given me so much?
It is not just the repayment of money, but more fundamentally a keeping of promise, which God is very keen upon. In the rare case a debt cannot be repaid, there is a mechanism in the law of bankruptcy, but it does come with consequences that few will lend again to one who breaks their word, except my credit card company :).
Happy New Year! ken
tommy · 619 weeks ago