Whenever I write about wives submitting to husbands, I receive comments from women upset with me and they try to advocate mutual submission based on the one verse that we are to submit to one another.
So I thought I would do an experiment. Let's throw out the five verses in the Bible that specifically admonish wives to submit to and obey their husbands. Okay, these verses are gone, now what?
Let's look at some other Bible verses about treating others ~
But whoever wishes to become great among you shall be our servant: and whoever wishes to be first among you shall be slave of all.
Mark 10:43,44
Mark 10:43,44
{We are called to serve others.}
Above all, keep fervent in your love for one another, because love covers a multitude of sins.
I Peter 4:8
I Peter 4:8
{We are told to love others deeply.}
Older women...encourage young women to love their husbands.
Titus 2:3,4
{Wives are specifically called to love their husbands.}
Titus 2:3,4
{Wives are specifically called to love their husbands.}
What does love look like according to I Corinthians 13...patient, kind, not jealous, does not brag, is not arrogant, does not act unbecomingly, does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered, does not rejoice in unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth, bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things...NEVER fails.
Okay, wives, you don't need to submit to your husbands anymore just serve them, love them, put up with their bad habits and offenses, bear all things, endure all things, etc. Thank goodness this is all the Lord requires of us and not that dirty word "submission."
Now some of you will say, "Yes, but our husbands aren't loving us like they are called to love us." This seems to be a huge stumbling block to women obeying Scripture. YOU are not responsible for your husband's behavior, like I have said many times before. You are just responsible for your own.
Never forget the promise God gave to women that we may win them without a word and cling to that. Remember Jesus is our example ~
Do nothing from selfishness or empty conceit, but with humility of mind let each of you regard one another as more important than himself {I think this includes our husbands.}. Do not merely look out for your own personal interests, but also for the interests of others. Have his attitude in ourselves which was also in Christ Jesus.
Philippians 2:3-5
Logging you in...
Carrie B · 692 weeks ago
Tiffany · 692 weeks ago
Courtney · 692 weeks ago
Deborah · 692 weeks ago
Now, let's pray this can be put to rest once and for all and "they" finally get it. *sigh*
Another great post, Lori. God definitely guides your hand and heart.
Blessings, Deborah
jbeane6 36p · 692 weeks ago
Julie · 692 weeks ago
desirayl 16p · 692 weeks ago
Being married myself I submit to my husband and I know I am pleasing God I may not always agree with what He says but I submit and that is where most people get it wrong they think they must lay down like a rug and do what ever their husband says that is not submission at all.
Great post and don't worry about those who get mad they got mad at Jesus as well but He had a mission and so do you. You are helping allot of people you just aren't seeing it yet..God give her strength to speak the words you give her Lord..AMEN
Emily · 692 weeks ago
This weekend I experienced a lot of conviction at church about what this will look like for me as my husband takes classes leading toward a ministry degree. We are in a place we never saw ourselves going and I am thankful that God is molding us as we go!
I'm always thankful to hear people talking about the truth of scripture even in the face of opposition.
Visiting from A Pause on the Path
Shanda Oakley · 692 weeks ago
Ken · 692 weeks ago
So yes, mutual submission is part of a Christian’s life and marriage, but God intends for the wife to come uniquely under her husband's leadership and for the husband to take leadership and be the head of his wife and family. It is a beautiful thing that is happening in my marriage and the marriage of many other Christian women when a wife trusts God at His Word and surrenders to His Will by surrendering leadership to her husband.
And yes, as you have pointed out, a godly husband will use servant leadership to love his wife and care for her, even as he seeks to honor the Lord in casting the deciding vote on any conflicting decisions. Mutual submission is not a strong Biblical concept, although service for one another and treating one another as more important than one's self is. Christians do not "come under" other Christians authority in any way, unless of course if they are our elders or our parents.
A godly man should have no problem listening to his wife and deferring to her wishes and desires 99% of the time, especially if she is willing to give him veto power over the 1% areas of disagreement. But submission is far more than just in decision making. It is an attitude of surrender that desires the leadership of the husband in her home and in her life. Husband and wife surrendered to God, wife surrendered to her husband, children obeying parents is God-ordained recipe for a happy, holy home.
Jen · 692 weeks ago
PJB · 692 weeks ago
However, what the Bible does say is that a husband IS the head OF his wife. It does not say that he should be, nor that it must be established, nor that it is possible in any case or sutuation that a many is not indeed the head of his wife. it is not a command, it is a statement of fact -- an important fact that is not any less true in situations where it may be misunderstood.
No authority over other persons is given to married male Christians by the Bible, and the Bible does not mention any kind of decision making process, not any kind of marital leadership whatsoever. Words like that are simply not present in the passages, and it is your presuppositions that lead you to believe they are implied. These things you have said are the 'thoughts about Scripture' that some people have, but people's thoughts about Scripture are not, in themselves, equivalent to Scripture.
PJP · 692 weeks ago
PJB · 692 weeks ago
I'm not surprised this works well for you -- I can see in your words and in Lori's that you are a gifted leader, that you are wise and godly, and that you offer very beneficial leadership in your family, from the heart of a servant (a submissive heart). It is clear that Lori rejoices to follow you willingly. I simply disagree with the idea that you have this arrangement because you are male and therefore an automatic leader, and that as a female she has only the choice of a follower if she is seeking godliness.
Not every man is a gifted leader (as Scripture clearly teaches) and the leadership arrangement in marriage that is wonderful in your lives is not the only one that makes sense in light of Scripture.
Ken · 692 weeks ago
The desire to expunge the Christian husband’s authority to manage his home is baffling, especially in light of the passage concerning the qualifications of an elder in I Tim 3:5 and the many passages that command a wife to be submissive:
“For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?”
Wives, submit to your own husbands, as to the Lord" (Eph. 5:22). "Just as the church is subject to Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in everything" (5:24).
You know the many other passages that relate to submission.
To be head of one’s wife, to rule over one’s home, to have a submissive wife, all strongly implies a husband’s responsibility to exercise loving leadership over his wife and family. Leadership has within itself a certain authority to make decisions and to “rule” or “manage.”
Authority is not in and of itself a bad thing, especially in a marriage. The type of leadership and authority to be used by a husband who “manages his household well” is one of loving benevolent authority. The authority is granted to him in many ways by his wife’s loving submission as she willingly “comes under” his leadership as head. To find that the husband is head of the wife and she is to be “in subjection to him in everything” and yet to deny that he has authority to provide leadership for the home, seems a baffling perspective for this student of the Word.
I think where we can agree is on how that authority is to be applied, but I would go so far as to say that a Christian husband who has a wife or children who are not under control, and are unwilling to be submissive, may have godly license to be quite firm in his requests of his wife or kids, and may use whatever loving means he deems appropriate to try and manage them or rule them. The tough part for any manager, boss or husband is how to apply one’s authority in a gentle and loving manner, as a leader without followers is no leader at all.
So I would suggest that the Scriptures clearly teaches husband’s headship (leadership and many more good things that goes beyond authority) over the wife, and that the two of them together lead their home. But there will be a time for any leader where the exercise of authority is necessary. To strip headship of its authority is to see Christ as never exercising discipline to move the believer from where they are to where they need to go. He seemingly exercises such discipline very rarely, but He does use it out of love, and beyond this, He certainly expects us to obey the authority of His Word. “For a husband is the head of his wife as Christ is the head of the church”
For those who would lean towards the idea that “head” means “source” instead of authority, I would refer you to this article which clearly shows that the word “head” is linked directly to authority and submission: http://carm.org/1-cor-113-word-head-does-not-mean...
PJB · 692 weeks ago
In the NT, references are made both to men 'managing/ruling the household' and to women 'managing/ruling the household'... I'm surprised you missed that. You seem like an intelligent guy. There is no indication that the husband's management is superior to the wife's management of household affairs.
To be head of one's wife implies the essential unity of the species (both genders) the derivation of the female from the male (as per Genesis 2) -- and (in parallel) the specific unity of a marriage, with the source of that unity being the male, who initiates the marriage and the marital unity. It also acts as an expression of the image of God and the eternal relationship between the Father and the Son -- implying, in parallel with the above -- the essential unity of the Godhead, and the Father as the 'source' of the Son.
To rule / manage one's home refers to the practical skills of being able to handle things like household staff, finances, use of space, allocation of resources etc.
PJB · 692 weeks ago
To have a submissive wife implies that one's wife is a godly woman who has a high regard for you as a person indwelt by the Spirit of her Lord Jesus, that she serves you selflessly and loves you deeply.
None of these things are about leadership or authority -- those 'implications' you see are your personal thoughts and interpretive conclusions (just as the above are my personal thoughts and interpretive conclusions).
Leadership is a ministry that one Christian submissively offers another Christian. If the ministry is acceptable, and accepted by its intended recipient, then it can be done submissively. If it is 'offered' in a sense that 'it's a rebellion against God if you reject this ministry' -- that's not servant leadership any more. If / when leadership is accepted from one person to another person, the recipient may indeed grant such authority to make decisions etc. as s/he sees fit to his/her leader. That would not be a bad thing at all. What's bad is when it's not free, not a choice, and not submissively offered.
PJB · 692 weeks ago
There is a distinct difference between the idea of being submissive and the idea of being ‘in subjugation’ or fundamentally subordinate. The Bible only uses one word in these commands -- we translate it 'submit' usually, and there is no need to confuse the issue by considering places where it may be translates 'in subjugation' as if they were a different command. A wife can be submissive to a husband in everything, without ever being 'in subjugation'.
We can agree on how leadership can be exercised -- we disagree on the point of where leadership authority comes from, and whether it is mandatory. Any man who offers his wife leadership, if she resists his "control" -- in this situation, his offer to lead has been rejected (probably because it came from a desire to put her under his control). If an offer to lead is rejected, any further attempts to control an adult peer are completely inappropriate and ungodly. Godly leadership is ONLY the servant leadership which is offered and accepted by a willing person.
PJB · 692 weeks ago
If a wife is unwilling to submit herself for others, including her husband, she disobeys her God and will be held accountable. This choice is about how her spiritual life affects her marriage -- it is not something a man is supposed to enforce!
As for kids, the authority over one's children is not the same. God grants parental authority in His law, and it is established to be used benevolently, but firmly if necessary. Parenting is more that leadership. Husbanding and parenting are not at all the same in the Bible.
There is no need to 'strip' headship of authority -- the Bible itself strips headship of authority when it says that God is the head of Christ. We all know that God and Christ are one, and that only the incarnation interrupted their unity and equality. The Trinity is perfect in unity and needs no leader. THAT is the implication of 'headship' for Christian marriage.
It’s clear that both opinions on headship exist on the internet – since we are sharing links so people can hear both perspectives: http://www.searchingtogether.org/kephale.htm
kelli Adventurez · 692 weeks ago
I'd like to recommend email as an option for philosophical differences to be discussed - it might be a better testimony to some who may not be mature Christians or not at all.
Both of you make very good points- there are many women (sadly) who are in abusive, controlling, evil situations - and unfortunately the church has thrown the word "submit" around to the point that it has been completely misunderstood and misused.
There are also many women who need to hush so their husband can actually hear the voice of God and learn to take the leadership roll in serving their families properly.
Thank you my brother & sisters in Christ for caring so much about what God has to say on the subject.
What a wonderful example from that little baby who came and was born in a stable who ultimately gave everything for us, His family. God bless, and Merry Christmas!
highheartedly 15p · 692 weeks ago
My husband is the one toting the mutual submission over "inequality" and we always said it was better that way (husband liberating wife) than the reverse (wife struggling to liberate self). But over the years I have realized that the idea of mutual submisison, mutual obedience devolves in my heart into mutual disobedience: if he's promised to obey me too, then I shouldn't have to obey him when I'm right... Am I right?
So now I say to mixed audiences, "Men, this one verse here is not to you so keep silent. It's where God is talking to his ladies hearts and you're just being left out here." And I explain as best I can to the women about my experience of mutual disobedience. Lately Psalm 103 hit me hard, that the Word of God is eternal while our days are like grass. So I add, "It will still say Wives, submit to your husbands long after I'm gone and whether or not I did!"
Gives us pause.
MrsH@Metamorphing Me · 692 weeks ago
Heidi · 692 weeks ago
Ken · 692 weeks ago
A recalcitrant wife does not take away the husband's responsibility to lead even if it may significantly curtain his ability to exercise authority (or call it decision making if one fears the word authority). Authority is a necessary part of leadership, especially to make a final decision.
Authority defined: the power to determine, adjudicate, or otherwise settle issues or disputes; jurisdiction; the right to control, command, or determine.
Ken · 692 weeks ago
Let’s teach Christian men clearly that if their leadership is not exercised in love, with the best interest of the wife first and foremost, then it is being abused (not necessarily abusive). Too many husbands abdicate their leadership roles because our wives would not submit (like I did). Many wives can convince a husband that he is inadequate to lead her or the family and the husband gives up too easily and lets her do her thing…, all the while she claims that her husband will not take any leadership in the family. Christian men must be taught both that they are God’s choice for leading the family and that their leadership must model after Christ. And Christ had no problem rebuking his disciples if he felt it necessary. Actually, I think that a Christ-like rebuke may be too harsh for our wives :), but perhaps not in the storm of some marital conflicts.
So we should not strip a husband of the authority aspect of his God appointed leadership. One’s fear of husbands abusing their authority should not make one strip such authority and leadership from the husband. Instead, women should be taught to submit, and men should be taught what it means to “love your wife as Christ loves the church.” The scriptures make it clear that authority is a good thing and that each one of us who are under authority should submit to it, so long as it does not go against God’s Word.
My final point is that we should let Lori teach the wife’s responsibilities in the marriage without trying to balance out her perspective each time. Lori believes that for too long the church and the older women have skirted around the issue of submission wanting instead to make the gospel more palatable to the modern age of equality, and have muddied the waters of Christian marriages. Many Christian wives are discovering for the first time what it is like to “come under” their husband in submission and surrender. Less arguing, more cuddling, more peace, more affection, more love… all found in a little word submission. But who would have guessed that God could get even this part of life right?
It’s scary and it risks that the husband may abuse his leadership, but most men are built to treat their wives like a princesses if they simply really believe that she is honoring him through submission and respect. It’s worth a try, and yes, watch out for any true abusiveness, but there is something special that happens in intimacy when a woman can convince her man that she is all his. Is that not what we also find with God when we are in full surrender to Him and His will?