Wednesday, July 27, 2016

Were the Women of Old Submissive?


The picture in our minds that we get about life during the Leave It to Beaver and Father Knows Best days is that all women must have been gentle, kind, modest, submissive to their husbands and love being keepers at home but was this really the case? No, women have always struggled with being cheerfully submissive and content being at home or else the Bible wouldn't have older women teaching younger women these things. Yes, there are some personalities that are more the pleasing types who don't fight and argue to get their way, but they are far and few between. All of this disobedience happened once sin entered the world and it is what we are fighting against. We may think it is only feminism but it is not.

Satan entered the world and became the prince of the power of the air when Eve wrested control from Adam and dashed all of civilization into chaos. Even most of the "great" women of old that we read about in the Old Testament weren't examples of godly womanhood at times. Sarah wanted her husband to sleep with another woman in order to get a baby, thus going against God's promise to her and Abraham's will. 

There weren't as many divorces before feminism took hold but I bet the majority of homes were still run by the women. It's just the way we're built. Most women want to be in control, have their own way, and make their husbands do what they want them to do through manipulation, refusal of sex, and many other creative ways. Yes, feminism has made it much worse for marriages and the children since mothers have left their homes and women don't rely on their husbands for provision anymore. This is absolutely a tragedy but most women throughout the centuries have struggled with control and lack of submission.

It is said that the Church is ten years behind culture and I believe it. The Church used to teach women about submission, having a meek and quiet spirit, and being keepers at home. Few churches teach this anymore so Christian women often look no better than their feminist neighbor in how they treat their husbands, what they wear, act, and what entertains them.

We need to stop going by our culture and our own selfish desire to control, and begin obeying the Word of God. No Christian woman should be following in the steps of feminism or rebellion. Begin studying the Word of God and become the submissive and obedient wife that the Lord calls you to become. Live within your husband's income even if this means living in a small home, not having Internet, and not eating out or going on vacations. Pursue what the Lord wants you to pursue, not this depraved culture.


If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, 
where Christ sits on the right hand of God.
Colossians 3:1

Comments (20)

Loading... Logging you in...
  • Logged in as
I think the majority of women "of old" accepted their God given roles. That being said, my own mom was a divorcee in the 1950's and wasn't saved by any means that was noticeable. There was no submissive spirit in her. I was raised to be very much "my own person", and the more I read in scripture the more I see my upbringing contradicting what scripture says.
3 replies · active 452 weeks ago
I am not sure of this, Angie, since sin has always been present in the world and the verse about a wife's desire will be to control her husband is in Genesis. There is no peace without the Lord. Paul wrote this about young women, "Besides, they get into the habit of being idle and going about from house to house. And not only do they become idlers, but also busybodies who talk nonsense, saying things they ought not to." (1 Timothy 5:13) They knew their place was in the home before feminism but they were still not content there.
Thats what I saw in my mom...the things Paul says to avoid. She was never content and taught me to be like that. After getting saved I learned that was wrong and I struggle all the time. I now have good Godly role model who show a true Titus 2 .
We all need a Titus 2 woman in our lives! God knew this and this is why He had Paul write Titus 2:4, 5. :)
HappyHomemaker's avatar

HappyHomemaker · 452 weeks ago

My personal opinion is that feminism has taught women to get jobs and never depend upon a man for anything. I know people (family and friends) that are older (70's) and even though the wife "obeyed" her husband and "submitted" to him, you can tell who runs the household. So, I think this has always been a problem and will always be a problem. Even now, knowing my role as a helpmeet and that my husband is the head of our family and even though my desire is to submit to him in all things, I sometimes have to remind myself to not try to nag him until he sees things my way. If I don't stay on top of it, I find myself slipping back into old habits (you know those same habits that made me miserable and kept me from having any peace because I was not being a helpmeet as I am called to be).
1 reply · active 452 weeks ago
I agree, HH. It's not always easy but it's what we are called to do. It does get easier the more we practice it, thankfully, and knowing the Spirit inside of us is giving us the strength to continue to do what is right!
Exactly, WW! You have a beautiful way with words. Thank you!
Fascinating post! I suspect many women try to "rule the roost", as you say. I couldn't say for sure, though, since I only know the women in my immediate circle. Your writings about sex, though, puzzle me, as I've never met a woman who used it as a manipulation tool. Can you tell me how you formed this belief? Most women I know enjoy intimacy as much as their husband. Blessings Pam.
Satan has always tried to tell us the opposite of what the Perfect, Inerrant Word of the Living God says. He says its hard to be a Christian and do what Christ demands of us, but the opposite, what the bible says is that the way of transgressors is hard. (Proverbs 13:15). I am an unmarried 21 year old young lady still living at home with my mom and dad. From some of my earliest memories, my mother would criticize my dad to other women in front of us, and even now she complains or rolls her eyes, or back talks, etc etc whenever my dad says something to her. Growing up, I had a bad relationship with my dad because of my rebellion and I knew if he told me to do something I could whine to my mom and get out of it. It wasn't until Jesus saved me as a 16 year old that he and I began forming a relationship. Now, my mother and I have had problems because I try to obey my dad and its grievous to her. We weren't taught to clean home or have food on the table when our working papa came home, but now I try to make sure dad comes home to clean dishes and cooked food. I say this because if it weren't for my Jesus, I would be horribly rebellious and my dad and I would not have a relationship. I am not perfect, I still struggle with rebellion and many many times have had to ask my dad and my mom to forgive me, but the heart change is real. Women of old weren't perfect either, but I can't imagine feminism was as bad as it is now.
Lady Virtue's avatar

Lady Virtue · 452 weeks ago

I especially like the writing in the notebook encouraging women to pursue God's ways rather than those of the world. Something like that could go viral, but that would be a good thing! :-)

I know the Lord will give you the strength to stand, Lori, just as He has before, to keep speaking His truth.
Pam,

LOL! My mom admitted she used sex to manipulate my dad. She taught my sister to do this to her husband who said, "ok, there are other women out there", and proceeded to find and cheat on my sister. BACKFIRE! My wife did it to me and she told me her mom told her to!

Yes women enjoy sex, but you are deceiving yourself and others if you think women WANT sex at the SAME frequency as men.

Yes, there are women who enjoy as much frequency, but it is rare.

As far as using it as manipulation, many women may not intentionally set out to use it as manipulation, but if they refuse sex because they don't 'feel' loved at that moment you are 'manipulating' the husband to 'make good' so that you feel more 'loved' before you will nt refuse him. SAME THING as manipulation.

Without being rude, please look up the definition of manipulation. Search your heart and you will see that manipulation is in all of our hearts and sex in marriage has been used as a tool for women for ages.
6 replies · active 452 weeks ago
Jeff, thanks for your explanation of manipulation. If this is manipulation, than I am manipulating my husband, too. :(
This is really eye-opening for me.
What if the man is doing this? Refusing, refusing, refusing? Is it manipulation too?. And I have a very high sex drive so am aware of the need for compromise. I am also doing all I can to respect him (of course there is always room for improvement) and he has said it is not that. That he just does not feel like it.

As background: we have a nine-month-old son and an almost two-year-old daughter. I am home full time with them. I also work from home and take care of the housework. I try to make sure that my husband does not have to work "another shift" when he gets home, that he would just get to rest.
This is a Great question. Can a man manipulate?
See my answer above Pam. One spouse's sins does not justify another's. Selfishness often leads to manipulation and getting my way. This is not the Christian way of sacrificial love.

That said, there is a difference between leading and manipulation. and manipulation and discipline. A husband's role requires him at times, hopefully few, to make certain decisions or take certain actions for the good of the family, which a wife may perceive as manipulation, but it is only leadership. Her view is colored by her own selfishness.

For instance, if money is tight, but a wife keeps spending in areas that a husband has already said no, or on things that are unnecessary, then the husband cuts the Internet out, maybe TV, is this manipulation of is it leadership? Well it will be poor leadership if all of the sudden these things and the electricity are cut off.

God calls on husbands to provide loving sacrificial leadership then leaves wide room as to how this is accomplished in each marriage. Just as no two wives are the same, neither will a husband's leadership style. A Christian woman should choose wisely which husband she will follow for the rest of her life.

I will also suggest that at times a husband can be manipulative even in his leadership, but a wife could end this sin by simply deciding to follow his wishes before he feels the desire to manipulate. A husband should not have to manipulate to get what he feels is best.

If a husband is manipulating a wife to sin, she must stand against sin and gently decline. No amount of manipulation from any source should cause us to sin. Be careful to differentiate that to be sin it must be clearly taught against in God's Word, not a matter of conscience, as a husband's conscience should be informing a wife's conscience. This is not to say a husband should be forcing his conscience upon a wife, as a godly husband will be sensitive that if she does not believe drinking a glass of wine is beneficial, he should not insist upon it. But a godly wife is always trying to follow her husband's lead and learn from him, instead of stubbornly holding firm to what she considers to be her conscience which may be poorly informed by her past upbringing and experiences.
Yes! Please answer!
Certainly men can manipulate and also simply disobey God's clear instructions in the passages on not depriving a spouse. Sin has no gender boundaries, but to the point of the post, and to Jeff's comment, very few women think they are being manipulative when they are trying to control or use sex to get what they want or to punish their husband. Few men or women in marriages understand that manipulation can come from frowns, moods, unkind words, etc. intended to sting and get a change of behavior from a spouse.

God says we are not to be this way, but we are to speak honestly and sincerely in love to one another and be sure that we place the interest of our spouse over our own.

I am always concerned that a husband who wants less frequency in sex than a wife is either not eating well, resting well, filled with stress, has something physically wrong or is into porn and self-sex. Any one of these things can be the problem and ideally these things are not off limits in a discussion. There can be at times a spouse who doesn't feel like it because of the way they feel treated by his wife, and at times weight issues. Lastly, you have psychological issues that at times impacts a sex life.

Being able to honestly talk about things together is very important, not in an accusatory way, but in a way to gain understanding. I know there were times when I am stressed out that sex is not desired, but I also know that sex is a great stress reliever as it can distract from the stress if only for a few minutes.

If you are married to a Christian husband, ask gently for a reasonable answer to your desires and sexual needs. God would not tell us to not deprive each other if he did not in most circumstances give the way to accomplish His will. But you must work together to arrive at a place where you can feel satisfied.
I think women entering the workforce really began with the World Wars. I've been watching period dramas that take place during both WW and the women in the shows are shown to be heading into the workforce because pretty much all the young and able men were off fighting. no one to run the store, work in the warehouse, etc. besides the "normal" female jobs of the time where ladies were nursing or working in a store before they got married. it was common place that once a woman got married, she left work to stay at home, presumably because her husband would care for her. well a lot of men never made it home or when they did come home- couldn't find work or were disabled so they couldn't work. so women ended up staying in the workforce.
i personally don't see an issue with women working as long as it is right for her family. some women are not working 40 hour a week jobs with their children in day care all day long. some are working weekends while their family watches the littles so they can help their family. i work in catering so it's extremely flexible and i can basically pick my own schedule. i have a cousin who works 2 days a week as an OT and her mom watches her children. the kids love it and my aunt loves it. obviously this is not to say this would work for all families.

Post a new comment

Comments by